Muse alternatives?

[lolpie]

Note: This used to be a thread about ForexAutopilot (FAPS), you can read all about it in the following pages. This thread has been converted into my manual trading w/ forex blog so you guys can see if this is something that could become your muse.

Lolpie's forex blog

I suggest everyone takes a few hours and reads this forex guide (http://www.babypips.com/school/the_skinny_on_forex.html) before attempting to understand forex...

I am using the manual version of OzFx's system (http://forums.babypips.com/free-forex-trading-systems/10419-ozfx-system-100-800-pips-per-trade.html) on all major pairs.

Initial deposit: $300
Micro account @ Alpari with 0.01 minimum lots

I will update this one post with the newest information, for simplicity's sake, once a week.

Feel free to ask questions, but remember that I'm still learning as I go, so take everything I say with a grain of salt :P

http://lolpie.x10hosting.com/

[badhank]

show us some daily/weekly numbers or percentages if u dont mind, im interested

[TimW]

1. If it sounds too good to be true, it likely is.
2. The people who always make money are those who get the commissions on when programs/people buy/sell/trade things like stocks/commodities/foreign exchange arbitrage or futures
3. If you know nothing about foreign exchange arbitrage, trading or futures, I suggest some serious reading OTHER than Wikipedia is in order.

If it was so easy to be making money on the Forex market, do you think Bear Stearns would have needed our money (via the Fed)?

[badhank]

If it was so easy to be making money on the Forex market, do you think Bear Stearns would have needed our money (via the Fed)?
no? (guessing)

[lolpie]

show us some daily/weekly numbers or percentages if u dont mind, im interested

I'm planning on running this for the next two weeks, I'll post the results then (and my verdict). It doesn't do trades on the weekends, btw

1. If it sounds too good to be true, it likely is.
2. The people who always make money are those who get the commissions on when programs/people buy/sell/trade things like stocks/commodities/foreign exchange arbitrage or futures
3. If you know nothing about foreign exchange arbitrage, trading or futures, I suggest some serious reading OTHER than Wikipedia is in order.

If it was so easy to be making money on the Forex market, do you think Bear Stearns would have needed our money (via the Fed)?

Party pooper!

Nah, kidding. I'll be reading up on this stuff this weekend, thanks.

[badhank]

similar topic, i was creating a stock bot, i still have to code, i just dont run it anymore (too busy)

i brute forced the nasdaq site for as many symbols as i could get starting from a-zzzz. this gave me a list of 14,000 symbols in my database. I then did a 1 year background on each of these companies and stored the closing day values and volume only. I ran simple math comparisons on these companies and isolated the "jumpiest" or most volatile and proceeded to invest small amt of $ from time to time in my experiment. I have been putting off setting this up again, but i think i just might, sparked my interests again. My model is geared to day-trading obviously, and 20% from day to day was easy with the pink sheets, but ur talking $10 trading fee and low volumes which really limits ur abilities.

[lolpie]

OK, so far.

April 4th - deposit $500 into practice account. Start learning the program and how to set it to auto-trade.

April 5th-6th - No trading on the weekends b/c market closes.

April 7th-9th (today) - account balance is currently $1025. I made 100% back in about four days. EDIT:I also did not have a single losing trade during this time. Will continue testing until 4/28/2008 and post results then. A few hours ago I closed that account and made a new one with different variables-trying to further decrease risk. I will post pics and my verdict/review on 4/28.

Peace out till then!

[badhank]

!!! amazing

[nghs22]

do you have a stop loss on your trades?

[lolpie]

Nope, Stoploss is set to 0.0

[VitaminD]

Keep us updated! I'm interested to see how you set it up.

[dada]

What currency pairs are you trading?

[lolpie]

EUR/USD, on the M1 chart.

[nghs22]

I don't know exactly how your program works, but I would suggest a stop loss. Especially in today's market, your profits could be gone in about 5 minutes without a stop loss placed on them. 10-15% would work. Just my opinion b/c i am a stock trader :)

[Seb]

Hi,

I have a couple of questions...

Where did you open your Forex trading account?
What are the trading fees?

Thanks,

Seb

[lolpie]

I don't know exactly how your program works, but I would suggest a stop loss. Especially in today's market, your profits could be gone in about 5 minutes without a stop loss placed on them. 10-15% would work. Just my opinion b/c i am a stock trader :)

I found this in the pdf when you buy the program:
Do not change these paramets! Stop lost must be 0. ForexAutopilot EA does not use fixed stop loss. It uses smart settings for stop
loss to close losing trades according to inner indicators. EA with fixed stop loss will finally loose your deposit if trading agains trend. Our
ForexAutopilot EA does not have such problem.

Hi,

I have a couple of questions...

Where did you open your Forex trading account?
What are the trading fees?

Thanks,

Seb

I opened it at Forexte.
About the trading fees - I just asked them and they said there aren't any fees, just spreads.

[nghs22]

[QUOTE=lolpie;9168]I found this in the pdf when you buy the program:
Do not change these paramets! Stop lost must be 0. ForexAutopilot EA does not use fixed stop loss. It uses smart settings for stop
loss to close losing trades according to inner indicators. EA with fixed stop loss will finally loose your deposit if trading agains trend. Our
ForexAutopilot EA does not have such problem.


I wonder why they don't use a trailing stop loss. I can understand not using a fixed stop loss. Maybe if the "program" recognizes when to sell that would work.

[lolpie]

You mean the TrailingStop? That is set to 500.

Regardless of the settings, I haven't had a losing trade yet, so I guess whatever the program is doing, it's working :D

[nghs22]

ya you have a trailing stop, which is good. let us know more please! :cool:

[Seb]

I found this in the pdf when you buy the program:
Do not change these paramets! Stop lost must be 0. ForexAutopilot EA does not use fixed stop loss. It uses smart settings for stop
loss to close losing trades according to inner indicators. EA with fixed stop loss will finally loose your deposit if trading agains trend. Our
ForexAutopilot EA does not have such problem.



I opened it at Forexte.
About the trading fees - I just asked them and they said there aren't any fees, just spreads.

I checked out Forexte and it seems it's only for educational purposes. Can you trade real dollars with it?

Thanks,

Seb

[lolpie]

Yeah, you're thinking of their education program. If you wanna open a real account just click on the Open Account link. Fill in the info and you're on your way.

[Seb]

I opened a Forex account, deposited the $250, and paid $90 for the software just to find out you need to know how to use ForexTrader.meta first.

The software looks cool but I have not idea how to use it nor Forex Autopilot.

The documentation is not good. It assumes you are already a trading pro.

I know there are plenty of books and information online about ForexTrader but it would take longer to study it than to get a muse live and generating profits from the ground up.

To be honest I'm pretty disappointed with my investment. Forex Autopilot should disclose that you need to know what you are doing to be able to use their product.

I would appreciate if anybody could provide me and the community with some quick tips so maybe I can make something good out of the investment.

Thanks,

Seb

[lolpie]

Wait, you deposited $250 into a live account?? Bad idea..you should have opened a practice (aka demo) account. It's basically forex trading but with virtual money, the program can't tell the difference. If you want I can send you my template, which already has everything set up so you just need to run the EA and watch it go.

[VitaminD]

Can you give us some links or something? :D I'm interested in checking this out. And could you send me that too?

[nghs22]

I found this, haven't bought it yet though. I am planning on it, just to check it out. Hell, it comes with a money back guarantee and I will not hesitate to use it if it sucks. Anyways, it claims that it comes with an extra ebook that gives you the parameters and stuff to make you successful. It's a affiliate link for the guy (not for me though :mad: ) and if you are going to buy it might as well try it out! Good luck guys. I will probably get it this weekend....



http://forexautopilotreview.com/

[lolpie]

Put this in your ForexTrader.Meta -> templates folder.

http://www.sendspace.com/file/3x8e2o

NOTE: DO NOT USE ON A LIVE ACCOUNT. MAKE A DEMO ACCOUNT HERE: http://www.forexte.com/metatrader.html#metatrader (enter a valid email, they send you the software)

[Seb]

Wait, you deposited $250 into a live account?? Bad idea..you should have opened a practice (aka demo) account. It's basically forex trading but with virtual money, the program can't tell the difference. If you want I can send you my template, which already has everything set up so you just need to run the EA and watch it go.

That would be great.

Is it http://www.sendspace.com/file/3x8e2o ?

How do templates work?

Thanks

[lolpie]

Download the file from that link. Put it in your C:\Program Files\ForexTrader.Meta\templates folder if you have Windows.

Now start up the program, then click on the very last button on the toolbar (next to the stopwatch).

Click on load template and choose the above template.

That's it!

Note: The template might've had my ForexAutopilot activation key in there...just replace mine with yours.

[Seb]

Fantastic! I will post my results.

[lolpie]

Just a quick observation - because of the supposed recession that the US is in, the market has been really "mellow" - I've been stuck on one trade in the past 3 days :(

[lolpie]

Quick update on one of my new accounts:

http://img399.imageshack.us/img399/2583/40257869mx6.jpg

Note: This is on a demo account, been running since last night.

[VitaminD]

Quick update on one of my new accounts:

http://img399.imageshack.us/img399/2583/40257869mx6.jpg

Note: This is on a demo account, been running since last night.

lolpie,

So what are your conclusions so far? Is this viable as a means of passive income, and can it be scaled? I'd be interested to see your input and how powerful you think this is capable of becoming.

[lolpie]

How much you make/lose with this program all depends on the settings you use. If you mess up, it's gonna end up costing you a fortune. That's why testing on demo accounts is the most important thing you can do if you're serious about doing Forex trading. Bottom line: Test, test, test. Once you're confident with the settings you're using, try it out on a live account.

My verdict: In my testing, it's been a solid performer - but I've only been testing for about 2 weeks. During that time it did great, making about $120-$200 per day and not losing a single one. However, lately the US economy has been sucking. I still haven't had a losing trade, but its been stuck on the same trade for 3-4 days.

My advice is to buy this program when the economy is better - it seems that you'll minimize risks and make more trades per day.

Kinda off-topic: IMO, Ferriss should've included automated Forex trading software like this as a "muse". It's more than possible to make a living off this, and it's a perfect muse because it's 99.95% automated (you just withdraw the profits into your bank account :D).

Let me know if you have any more questions, I hope this review was useful.

[VitaminD]

I have a few more questions if you don't mind! :)

Which program do you use, and how do I set up a test account? I'm highly interested in doing this, and I'm sure my brother would be, as he's really good at economics and stock exchanges (I realize this is Forex).

Also, I would love advice as to how you set YOURS up, if not a total system, at least some guidelines to get me in the right direction, what to test for, etc.

Thanks! Feel free to PM me too.

[padma]

This isn't one of those programs that inflates the numbers for test accounts only to have you lose your shirt come real money time is it?

[lolpie]

I have a few more questions if you don't mind! :)

Which program do you use, and how do I set up a test account? I'm highly interested in doing this, and I'm sure my brother would be, as he's really good at economics and stock exchanges (I realize this is Forex).

Also, I would love advice as to how you set YOURS up, if not a total system, at least some guidelines to get me in the right direction, what to test for, etc.

Thanks! Feel free to PM me too.

The program I'm using is called ForexAutopilot (http://forexautopilot.com). To set up a test account, go here (http://www.forexte.com/metatrader.html#metatrader). In a nutshell, FAPS (ForexAutopilot) is an EA (expert advisor), a script for the Forex trading software MetaTrader 4, which is used by basically the majority of brokers to trade currencies online. The script essentially automates everything for you, once you set it up and optimize it. It will trade for you 24x5 days a week, just leave the program running.*

*Note: Your computer HAS to be turned on, MetaTrader 4 needs to be running, and you need an internet connection Mon-Fri.

A practice account (aka a demo account), is the best way to test EAs. It's essentially identical to live trading (trading with real money), except the fact that the money is virtual and fees aren't subtracted from the profit.

I highly, HIGHLY suggest that you run this and any other EAs on a practice account to get a feel for how this works and understand the market.

Now by no means am I an expert on this, I've never traded anything in my life before, but I just set up the program according to the recommended settings and let it run. I already uploaded my template in a few previous posts, so just download and follow the directions in that post.

This isn't one of those programs that inflates the numbers for test accounts only to have you lose your shirt come real money time is it?

There are two kinds of testing on demo accounts: forward and backtesting.

Forward testing - essentially when you run the program like you were running it on an actual live account, it's as close as you can get to live trading. The EA will make decisions on-the-fly just like would on a live account. It as no knowledge of what's going to happen next, just like a live account.

Backtesting - this is when the program makes trades on previous graphs - meaning it will trade on a graph that happened lets say from 3/20/2008 - 4/5/2008. The problem here is that since it already knows the trends during this time, the losses are greatly reduced...be wary when people sell EAs with outrageous claims like 100% gain or 0% losses. They will show you proof, but it's 99.9% likely a backtest.

Hope that answers your questions!

[VitaminD]

hey lolpie, I downloaded the Demo Forex account and set up your template, and clicked load, but I can't tell if it did anything. in fact, I can't tell how anything works...lol. Is there a "getting started" link or something?

[lolpie]

Did you load the EURUSD M1 chart? Attach the EA to that chart, then load the template, then click on the "Expert Advisors" button at the top so there is a smiley face on the top-right corner of the EURUSD chart.

If you need more info on setting up the program, try take a look at the Autopilot FAQ pdf, that's where I figured everything out :)

If there's a smiley face on the chart, then you're all set...check back in 24 hours and you should have a few trades

[VitaminD]

Sorry lolpie I'm still totally lost -the only chart I can seem to load is EURUSD H1, and I don't know where that autopilot pdf is.

[lolpie]

When you load the EURUSD H1 chart, click on the M1 button on the toolbar (it's at the top, next to the M5, M15, M30...etc.) The H1 button should already be checked, so just click M1 and it switches to the M1 graph...

Here's the pdf: http://forexautopilot.com/autopilotFAQ.pdf

[VitaminD]

Makes more sense now. I'll try it out tonight.

When you let it make "live" trades for you, that's still under a practice account right? No money is being put out there?

[lolpie]

Live trading = trading with real money. You should be running the program under a demo account, where it gives you virtual money to invest with

[Vagabond]

This isn't one of those programs that inflates the numbers for test accounts only to have you lose your shirt come real money time is it?

I was thinking the same thing...

[Frank]

What is your margin on this? It looks like you're making about 0.002 cents per dollar / euro on each trade, so you must be in it for a bundle to make $40 per trade. It's a lot to be on the line for when the market goes south . . .

[lolpie]

I know, I know, that's why I'm running this for a few more weeks until I've fully tested the program before I start using real money...

[nghs22]

any updates?

[lolpie]

Watching Battlestar Galactica :D

But seriously -
I finally gave in and opened a REAL account with REAL money, and once I get my login info I'll post the final results on the 26th. I made yet another demo account and played around with it - had one losing trade, but I came out with a profit of $317 after 3 days of trading, when I started with an investment of $250 virtual cash.

EDIT: Never mind - after I deposited the money I found out that they (Forexte and Forex.com) don't use MetaTrader 4...now I have to wait until I get my login info so I can withdraw the money. I found a better alternative - FXPro.com. They have everything, plus use MetaTrader 4 and can pay your withdrawals via PayPal :)

EDIT 2: Never mind again, I was wrong. I chatted with someone @ Forex.com and they DO let you use MetaTrader 4 :). Once my account is approved (Monday or Tuesday), I'll be up and running.

Will post here again after 2 weeks. If you have any life-threatening questions please PM or email me, it's in my profile.

Monday, 4/21/08:
AAANNNNND TAKEOFF!
Started trading!!

[VitaminD]

I'll be watching this with great interest. Good luck to you!

[webgal]

I'm not very good with trading but I've been reading.

[sspain]

For a great amount of free information on Foreign Exchange trading go to www.babypips.com (I get nothing for you going there).

I've been running the program and have had nothing but losses from it. I'm still figiting with the settings and wanted to understand more about it in order to optimize the settings in the program. Found the above website. This website is more if you were going to actively trade the currency markets, but it gives you a decent understanding about what is going on.

Figured I would help anyone who wants to pursue this like myself understand the bolts, cogs, and mechanics behind automated forex trading.

[lolpie]

Argh...having compatibility issues/error messages with MetaTrader 4 and FAPS :(.

Some pics:

http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/2817/53320839pt8.jpg

http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/9186/66805423fh9.jpg

It's slightly different, throwing FAPS off.

[sspain]

Contact the technical support team at FAPS. I'm sure they can look at your screenshots and help you adjust the settings.

[lolpie]

I did - meanwhile I'm looking into a program called http://www.fx-metropolis.com/ac_Introduction.html

Success!

I finally got it to work on my live account. Spent about 6 hours looking for solutions (this seems a lot more important when it's real money on the line).

For those who're live trading with me, just email the creator of this program and tell him that you're activation ID is 0, and he will send you a version compatible with MetaTrader 4

In the meantime - check out this link for more EAs: http://fxreviews.blogspot.com/

[lolpie]

An update. Due to my own mistake I used the wrong setting in my live account and promptly lost $200 on my deposit of $250. If you’re signing up through Forexte like me, make sure you use the 4-digit settings for TakeProfit, TrailingStop and Slippage (they should all be the default settings when you run FAPS for the first time, not the ones suggested in the pdf).

Tip: if signing up at Forex.com, try out a demo account with THEM first, not the third party company like Forexte! They use different settings which rendered my FAPS useless till I got it working again. I learned this the hard way.

On the upside I’ve made about $250 since testing, but I’m confident the number can go up, it all depends on how much you deposit in the first place.

Also check out http://fxreviews.blogspot.com/ in the meantime if FAPS isn’t your thing.

[dking]

So what sort of investment does this take?

[lolpie]

It depends on how much you start with in the first place. If you start with $250 like me, you'll be making a few hundred a month...if you start with $50000 then you'll be making thousands a day

[VitaminD]

lolpie, it's May - are you going to update us with the overall results? Have you done so already?

[GriffCo]

Wow when I first read this book the first thing I did was try to set my forex back up.

[nghs22]

well i got the FAPS and promptly lost 1500 in demo money.....hmmm either i must have set it up wrong or this thing is shit....

[GriffCo]

Are you all paying for FAPS? it's like $400.

[nghs22]

Are you all paying for FAPS? it's like $400.

$89 mate..... with a guarantee if the shit is whack

[dking]

$89 mate..... with a guarantee if the shit is whack

Is that a special? Do you know what its using?

[nghs22]

Is that a special? Do you know what its using?

Just go to the site and order and it will pop up for $99

[nghs22]

I found this, haven't bought it yet though. I am planning on it, just to check it out. Hell, it comes with a money back guarantee and I will not hesitate to use it if it sucks. Anyways, it claims that it comes with an extra ebook that gives you the parameters and stuff to make you successful. It's a affiliate link for the guy (not for me though :mad: ) and if you are going to buy it might as well try it out! Good luck guys. I will probably get it this weekend....



http://forexautopilotreview.com/

btw...you don't have to buy the product from this link....just send the dude an email and it will autorespond with the ebook. It's not a very good one. If anyone wants I can send it to them....

[lolpie]

Sure, can you email it to me? My email is arana3 at live . com

Thanks

[nghs22]

ah mate I looked through my computer and realized I deleted it. sorry about that. It was junk anyway or I would not have deleted it....

[Prince Charming]

In the trading world, there is a name for fully automated computer software that trades for you: black box systems.

People with a lot more money and brains than all of us here combined have been chasing this holy grail for decades, but no system has ever been created that can deliver long-term consistent results.

I can see how it might be a slightly different story with currency exchange than with stocks, options and futures, but I still urge caution. You are probably going to lose money doing this.

[nghs22]

Well I got the program and have tested it for a couple of days now. Honestly as sketch as it seems (I FIRMLY believe in "If's it too good to be true than it is") my tests have given me $300 profit on a $3000 dollar deposit in a couple of days. I have included a picture for proof. It took me a LONG time to finally get these results. Many hours and lost demo money. I lost over 1500 the first time i tried!!! :eek:

http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/3568/80942630rb5.th.gif (http://img253.imageshack.us/my.php?image=80942630rb5.gif)

I will continue to test, but if I continue testing with these results, I will be playing with real money soon. I will let everyone know what comes about. :cool:

[lolpie]

Well I got the program and have tested it for a couple of days now. Honestly as sketch as it seems (I FIRMLY believe in "If's it too good to be true than it is") my tests have given me $300 profit on a $3000 dollar deposit in a couple of days. I have included a picture for proof. It took me a LONG time to finally get these results. Many hours and lost demo money. I lost over 1500 the first time i tried!!! :eek:

http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/3568/80942630rb5.th.gif (http://img253.imageshack.us/my.php?image=80942630rb5.gif)

I will continue to test, but if I continue testing with these results, I will be playing with real money soon. I will let everyone know what comes about. :cool:

Whoa - what settings are you using, can you post them here? Mine only trades once a day for some reason, can't figure it out.

Thanks

[TheBaker]

In the trading world, there is a name for fully automated computer software that trades for you: black box systems.

People with a lot more money and brains than all of us here combined have been chasing this holy grail for decades, but no system has ever been created that can deliver long-term consistent results.

I can see how it might be a slightly different story with currency exchange than with stocks, options and futures, but I still urge caution. You are probably going to lose money doing this.

X2, Forex is not an easy money option.

Learn all the technical & Fundamental theory first.

PS: lolpie, are you the same lolpie on the BB.com forums?

[GriffCo]

Babypips.com is a good place for free lessons.
the TSD forex forum is probably my favorite.

ps. lolpie and baker are you both from bb.com? small world

[nghs22]

update....had $150 and $100 losing trades last night. damn. haha. It was just demo money though. I changed the settings a little bit and I'm still experimenting so we'll see.


http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/1007/78771179eu8.th.gif (http://img230.imageshack.us/my.php?image=78771179eu8.gif)

[lolpie]

X2, Forex is not an easy money option.

Learn all the technical & Fundamental theory first.

PS: lolpie, are you the same lolpie on the BB.com forums?

Yep! What's your username there?

[nghs22]

Ok I have something that is not set up right....gotta play with it....

http://img329.imageshack.us/my.php?image=58485964bq1.gif

[GriffCo]

I'm hit5500 on bb.com and griffco on tsd forex, saw you there too lolpie!

[lolpie]

Quick update

Live account:
http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/2087/liveky5.jpg

Demo account:
http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/9605/democb6.jpg

[TheBaker]

Quick update

Live account:
http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/2087/liveky5.jpg

Demo account:
http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/9605/democb6.jpg

How much was your deposit in the live account? It says 0 on the picture.. Not familar with that trading platform though, I use Oanda.

[lolpie]

$250, and $500 for the demo one

[GriffCo]

lolpie is your only indicator ultra trend? And how does that work? Order when they cross with respective color?

I've decided to hit up the 10,20,50 sma with RSI14 method. It's working really good so far. I like simple indicators.

[lolpie]

Just reading through Babypips.com. GriffCo I didn't realize you were the one who posted here before ;)

"I've decided to hit up the 10,20,50 sma with RSI14 method" - sounds like technobabble, but it won't after I'm done reading!

Ultra Trend, straight from its pdf:

Features:
-Finds the trend (bullish/bearish: Up/down)
-Finds the power of trend
-Finds support/resistance levels
-Can help in finding elliot waves
-Has combination of ADX, Stohastic, MovingAverage and other indicators

P.S Have you heard of the OzFx manual trading system? The guy says it nets 100-800 pips per trade. Let me know what you think. http://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?t=63635

[GriffCo]

Just reading through Babypips.com. GriffCo I didn't realize you were the one who posted here.......
P.S Have you heard of the OzFx manual trading system? The guy says it nets 100-800 pips per trade. Let me know what you think. http://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?t=63635

Ha yeah babypips is nice. Best combination of free articles I've seen.

And I've heard of Ozfx haven't looked into it too much. I'm pretty sure from what I've heard that it is for long term trades, not sure what time from the claim of 100-800 is though. I kind of prefer m15 and m30 time frames but being able to only get on the computer once a week would be great!

I think it's best to focus on smaller timeframes at first for practice.

[lolpie]

One thing I learned from this is to never get involved in Forex without being knowledable first. If anyone is still following this thread, I recommend you go through Babypip's guide. It's simple and provides great info. I gave up on FAPS, I had too many losses (it CAN be succesful if you have enough capital and trade with a micro account, but that's not for me) and decided that manual trading is the way to go for some real $.

This doesn't mean I quit Forex trading, I'm just looking into manual trading right now which looks much more promising than EAs. I'm still learning the ropes but I'll still post my progress here. Read the very first post in this thread, it'll be updated from now on